Comments on: The wit and wisdom of Vinnie Colletta http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/ The News Blog of Comics Culture Sat, 11 Oct 2008 05:57:28 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.0.2 by: Growl http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-2358125 Mon, 22 Sep 2008 04:58:50 +0000 http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-2358125 Put me in the "I Love Vinnie" camp. Both his art work and his integrity. Put me in the “I Love Vinnie” camp. Both his art work and his integrity.

]]> by: Gordon 'Kid' Robson http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-1900198 Tue, 08 Jul 2008 15:56:56 +0000 http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-1900198 Wow...some of these exchanges get a little personal, eh? Jack Kirby deserves everything good ever said about him, but this 'deification' of every pencil stroke he ever rendered takes things a little too far. In my humble opinion, magnificent as Kirby's pencils were, Kirby art as inked by Wood, Sinnott, Ayers and, yes, even Colletta, was nicer to look at than Kirby inked by himself or printed directly from the pencils. It's interesting to note that, in the couple of instances I've seen where Kirby inked himself, to me, the end result does not seem too disimilar to that of Colletta. Speaking as someone who re-inked and restored a few pages of Kirby's art for a couple of the Marvel Masterwork volumes, when some of the 'abstractness' of Jack's work was diluted or subdued by another hand (and I'm NOT talking about the pages I worked on), the end result was the better for it. Colletta made Jack's musculature on THOR actually believable, so, on balance, he gave it far more than he took away from it. Certainly, when I read the THOR tales in high quality black and white reproduction in the pages of FANTASTIC (a British publication) back in the 60s, I did not feel I was viewing 'second-rate' art. Feel free to disagree, but please...no vitriol. Wow…some of these exchanges get a little personal, eh? Jack Kirby deserves everything good ever said about him, but this ‘deification’ of every pencil stroke he ever rendered takes things a little too far. In my humble opinion, magnificent as Kirby’s pencils were, Kirby art as inked by Wood, Sinnott, Ayers and, yes, even Colletta, was nicer to look at than Kirby inked by himself or printed directly from the pencils. It’s interesting to note that, in the couple of instances I’ve seen where Kirby inked himself, to me, the end result does not seem too disimilar to that of Colletta. Speaking as someone who re-inked and restored a few pages of Kirby’s art for a couple of the Marvel Masterwork volumes, when some of the ‘abstractness’ of Jack’s work was diluted or subdued by another hand (and I’m NOT talking about the pages I worked on), the end result was the better for it. Colletta made Jack’s musculature on THOR actually believable, so, on balance, he gave it far more than he took away from it. Certainly, when I read the THOR tales in high quality black and white reproduction in the pages of FANTASTIC (a British publication) back in the 60s, I did not feel I was viewing ’second-rate’ art. Feel free to disagree, but please…no vitriol.

]]> by: Reck http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-1832962 Sat, 28 Jun 2008 05:08:12 +0000 http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-1832962 <strong>effective book reading skill...</strong> Thanks for the information, love it.... effective book reading skill…

Thanks for the information, love it….

]]> by: mike rockwitz http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-1545970 Mon, 12 May 2008 16:22:01 +0000 http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-1545970 I worked with Vinnie on the classic New Universe series, Justice and a few other stinkers. During this time of growth in Marvel's history, when Jim Shooter would lurk in your doorway and say, "Give the book to Vinnie" you didn't have much choice. Most of the good artists fled Marvel for DC during the end of Shooter's regime. Vinnie was quite a character, sure he erased backgrounds but in the grand scheme of things did it matter? Maybe he inspired the background-less hacks like Liefeld and his ilk in the 90s. A lot of shit has been said about Vinnie once he left this mortal coil. Everyone gets pretty brave sitting behind a computer. No one would ever say any of this shit to his face-he was about 5 foot 7 on a good day and built like a bull in his 60s!!! In this day and age of whiny bitch ass artists, we could use a few more pros like Vinnie. It is a BUSINESS to sell books not hang this shit in a museum. I remember the day that letter came into the Marvel offices. It was Vinnie being Vinnie-you bunch of yellow, prickless... I worked with Vinnie on the classic New Universe series, Justice and a few other stinkers. During this time of growth in Marvel’s history, when Jim Shooter would lurk in your doorway and say, “Give the book to Vinnie” you didn’t have much choice. Most of the good artists fled Marvel for DC during the end of Shooter’s regime. Vinnie was quite a character, sure he erased backgrounds but in the grand scheme of things did it matter? Maybe he inspired the background-less hacks like Liefeld and his ilk in the 90s. A lot of shit has been said about Vinnie once he left this mortal coil. Everyone gets pretty brave sitting behind a computer. No one would ever say any of this shit to his face-he was about 5 foot 7 on a good day and built like a bull in his 60s!!! In this day and age of whiny bitch ass artists, we could use a few more pros like Vinnie. It is a BUSINESS to sell books not hang this shit in a museum. I remember the day that letter came into the Marvel offices. It was Vinnie being Vinnie-you bunch of yellow, prickless…

]]> by: Ed Gauthier http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-1496723 Wed, 07 May 2008 08:32:05 +0000 http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-1496723 "If the average comic book fan could see some of the excesses originally pencilled in by the Kirbys, etc. of the art world they would be thankful, indeed, that an inker stepped in and got rid of some of the clutter..." Nice try, but no, Coletta did not magically know to erase only the "right" background images - he just erased everything in a mad dash for the deadline. That's mainly why this unabashed hack was used, and even then only as a last resort when something had gone horribly wrong. He was the "hitman" that sometimes had to called in at the last moment to take care of the dirty work, even though you didn't really want to. Sure, he was steadily employed by the bosses in the organization because he got the job done, but it wasn't a pretty sight, my friend. Better you should maybe go out and look at some nice flowers outside in the park or somethin' - capice? “If the average comic book fan could see some of the excesses originally pencilled in by the Kirbys, etc. of the art world they would be thankful, indeed, that an inker stepped in and got rid of some of the clutter…” Nice try, but no, Coletta did not magically know to erase only the “right” background images - he just erased everything in a mad dash for the deadline.

That’s mainly why this unabashed hack was used, and even then only as a last resort when something had gone horribly wrong. He was the “hitman” that sometimes had to called in at the last moment to take care of the dirty work, even though you didn’t really want to.

Sure, he was steadily employed by the bosses in the organization because he got the job done, but it wasn’t a pretty sight, my friend. Better you should maybe go out and look at some nice flowers outside in the park or somethin’ - capice?

]]> by: Fred Hemmingway http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-1043150 Tue, 11 Mar 2008 13:09:10 +0000 http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-1043150 Vince Colletta's go-for-broke honesty is remarkable in a world where most people are afraid to say "boo" for fear of being criticized or, worse, fired. Colletta is a great example of a bygone era where men were men and stood up for their beliefs. Vince Colletta’s go-for-broke honesty is remarkable in a world where most people are afraid to say “boo” for fear of being criticized or, worse, fired. Colletta is a great example of a bygone era where men were men and stood up for their beliefs.

]]> by: Billy Taylor http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-687142 Tue, 08 Jan 2008 01:27:35 +0000 http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-687142 One comment that I would like to make regarding inkers who erase some of the pencillers work: Many illustrators are prima donnas and cry when anyone dares to make changes to their work. If the average comic book fan could see some of the excesses originally pencilled in by the Kirbys, etc. of the art world they would be thankful, indeed, that an inker stepped in and got rid of some of the clutter. Why do you think that most pencillers were not allowed to ink their own panels? Be thoughtful. Think. One comment that I would like to make regarding inkers who erase some of the pencillers work: Many illustrators are prima donnas and cry when anyone dares to make changes to their work. If the average comic book fan could see some of the excesses originally pencilled in by the Kirbys, etc. of the art world they would be thankful, indeed, that an inker stepped in and got rid of some of the clutter. Why do you think that most pencillers were not allowed to ink their own panels? Be thoughtful. Think.

]]> by: R. Maheras http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-143242 Tue, 01 May 2007 14:20:18 +0000 http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-143242 I guess the best way to sum up (for me) Colletta's inks on Kirby's work is that it was transparent to me when I was a young Marvel Zombie and didn't know any better. However, once I became more savvy, and learned how the comics industry sausage was made, Colletta's inks became much more problematic for me. That being said, he, and other slop-ink speedsters like George Roussos, probably saved Stan Lee's butt on deadline many, many times. Of all of Kirby's inkers, I can't truthfully say Colletta was "the worst." I can, however, quickly name about a dozen inkers who did a more attractive, effective job inking Kirby, in my opinion. I guess the best way to sum up (for me) Colletta’s inks on Kirby’s work is that it was transparent to me when I was a young Marvel Zombie and didn’t know any better. However, once I became more savvy, and learned how the comics industry sausage was made, Colletta’s inks became much more problematic for me.

That being said, he, and other slop-ink speedsters like George Roussos, probably saved Stan Lee’s butt on deadline many, many times.

Of all of Kirby’s inkers, I can’t truthfully say Colletta was “the worst.” I can, however, quickly name about a dozen inkers who did a more attractive, effective job inking Kirby, in my opinion.

]]> by: Journalista - the news weblog of The Comics Journal » Blog Archive » May 1, 2007: Hunter S. Thompson’s missed opportunity http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-143194 Tue, 01 May 2007 13:00:26 +0000 http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-143194 [...] I&#8217;ll be damned if I know what to make of this transcription of a phone conversation with late comic-book inker Vince Colletta, recorded shortly after editor-in-chief Jim Shooter was fired from Marvel and Colletta found himself out of favor with replacement EiC Tom DeFalco, let alone the fuming-from-the-ears letter reproduced at the link (excerpted above), but they&#8217;re entertaining as all hell. (Link via Heidi MacDonald.) [...] […] I’ll be damned if I know what to make of this transcription of a phone conversation with late comic-book inker Vince Colletta, recorded shortly after editor-in-chief Jim Shooter was fired from Marvel and Colletta found himself out of favor with replacement EiC Tom DeFalco, let alone the fuming-from-the-ears letter reproduced at the link (excerpted above), but they’re entertaining as all hell. (Link via Heidi MacDonald.) […]

]]> by: Dave Gibbons http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-143067 Tue, 01 May 2007 09:09:30 +0000 http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-143067 I've got a lot of respect for Coletta's work ethic and I can remember when his inking on early "Tales Of Asgard" was hailed as an artistic breakthrough. However, talking of interviews and transcripts, I was once moved to channel his *perceived* persona over at http://www.comicon.com/moore/7_interview_dashing.htm I’ve got a lot of respect for Coletta’s work ethic and I can remember when his inking on early “Tales Of Asgard” was hailed as an artistic breakthrough.

However, talking of interviews and transcripts, I was once moved to channel his *perceived* persona over at

http://www.comicon.com/moore/7_interview_dashing.htm

]]> by: Patrick McEvoy http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-142949 Tue, 01 May 2007 04:45:27 +0000 http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-142949 Hmm... What's a "pancil"? I'll bet I meant "pencil"... Hmm… What’s a “pancil”? I’ll bet I meant “pencil”…

]]> by: Patrick McEvoy http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-142947 Tue, 01 May 2007 04:44:01 +0000 http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-142947 I'm going to go out on a limb here and proclaim that I'm one of only eight known people in the western hemisphere who actually *like* Colleta's work on Kirby. That is to say, I think Thor had a great look, despite the horrific, apocolyptic insanity of VC actually erasing some of Kirby's hallowed pancils. I think that Colleta's hatching effects added an otherworldly softness and illustrative quality that really fit the Thor world well. So shoot me. :P I’m going to go out on a limb here and proclaim that I’m one of only eight known people in the western hemisphere who actually *like* Colleta’s work on Kirby. That is to say, I think Thor had a great look, despite the horrific, apocolyptic insanity of VC actually erasing some of Kirby’s hallowed pancils. I think that Colleta’s hatching effects added an otherworldly softness and illustrative quality that really fit the Thor world well.

So shoot me. :P

]]> by: Liz Glass http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-142834 Tue, 01 May 2007 01:39:29 +0000 http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-142834 Kyle worked as Vinnie Colleta's assistant back in those days. Kyle is on deadline right now, but I will say Vinnie Colleta made quite the impression on my husband as a young man. But it was Colleta that trained Kyle to work quickly and efficiently, using a timer and a set amount of time for each panel. This ultimately proved to be an extremely valuable skill. Kyle also told me a lot of juicy Vinnie Colleta stories; maybe he'll blog about it at some point. Kyle worked as Vinnie Colleta’s assistant back in those days. Kyle is on deadline right now, but I will say Vinnie Colleta made quite the impression on my husband as a young man. But it was Colleta that trained Kyle to work quickly and efficiently, using a timer and a set amount of time for each panel. This ultimately proved to be an extremely valuable skill. Kyle also told me a lot of juicy Vinnie Colleta stories; maybe he’ll blog about it at some point.

]]> by: Bulent http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-142702 Mon, 30 Apr 2007 21:53:31 +0000 http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-142702 @Sleestak True, erasing the pencils of a revered figure like Kirby is sacrilege, but at the time comics were considered a lowly artform that was as disposable as yesterday's newspapers. It's worth following the link and reading the transcript of Colleta's phone conversation. It's rare to find the office politics of a popular institution laid bare in such a fashion. @Sleestak

True, erasing the pencils of a revered figure like Kirby is sacrilege, but at the time comics were considered a lowly artform that was as disposable as yesterday’s newspapers.

It’s worth following the link and reading the transcript of Colleta’s phone conversation. It’s rare to find the office politics of a popular institution laid bare in such a fashion.

]]> by: Sleestak http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-142599 Mon, 30 Apr 2007 19:02:50 +0000 http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-142599 I am one of the legion who disliked Coletta's art style with a passion, but I have always recognized that he was the go-to inker for a book that needed to be done on time for printing. If the book needed to be done in time for the printer, Colletta could usually be counted on to get the job done. On the other hand, I get emotionally upset whenever I read the early Thor tales he worked on with Jack Kirby. I am one of the legion who disliked Coletta’s art style with a passion, but I have always recognized that he was the go-to inker for a book that needed to be done on time for printing. If the book needed to be done in time for the printer, Colletta could usually be counted on to get the job done. On the other hand, I get emotionally upset whenever I read the early Thor tales he worked on with Jack Kirby.

]]> by: Peter Sanderson http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-142527 Mon, 30 Apr 2007 16:54:13 +0000 http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2007/04/30/the-wit-and-wisdom-of-vinnie-colletta/#comment-142527 The online publication of the Colletta letter should serve as a warning. Between news blogs and the increasing media and academic interest in comics, all the behind the scenes stories about the comics business will eventually become public. Bad behavior will sooner or later come to light. The online publication of the Colletta letter should serve as a warning. Between news blogs and the increasing media and academic interest in comics, all the behind the scenes stories about the comics business will eventually become public. Bad behavior will sooner or later come to light.

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