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	<title>Comments on: I guess this was a long time ago</title>
	<link>http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/12/09/i-guess-this-was-a-long-time-ago/</link>
	<description>The News Blog of Comics Culture</description>
	<pubDate>Mon, 23 Nov 2009 15:35:33 +0000</pubDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.0.2</generator>

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		<title>by: Rich Johnston</title>
		<link>http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/12/09/i-guess-this-was-a-long-time-ago/#comment-2712537</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Dec 2008 15:16:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/12/09/i-guess-this-was-a-long-time-ago/#comment-2712537</guid>
					<description>Or organise...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Or organise&#8230;
</p>
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		<title>by: Peter Krause</title>
		<link>http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/12/09/i-guess-this-was-a-long-time-ago/#comment-2709510</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Dec 2008 21:11:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/12/09/i-guess-this-was-a-long-time-ago/#comment-2709510</guid>
					<description>Richard Pachter:

All points duly noted and well presented.

&quot;Moral&quot; does not equal &quot;legal&quot;.   Read those contracts closely, boys and girls.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Richard Pachter:</p>
<p>All points duly noted and well presented.</p>
<p>&#8220;Moral&#8221; does not equal &#8220;legal&#8221;.   Read those contracts closely, boys and girls.
</p>
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		<title>by: Richard Pachter</title>
		<link>http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/12/09/i-guess-this-was-a-long-time-ago/#comment-2706358</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Dec 2008 01:55:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/12/09/i-guess-this-was-a-long-time-ago/#comment-2706358</guid>
					<description>Peter Krause:

If it were up to me, I would certainly bestow all rights to Watchmen on Alan and Dave.

But it's not up to me; in the real world, DC has a valid claim to those rights.

Is it morally correct? Again, not to me. But it seems to be legally valid. If it isn't, I'd hope an attorney would advise Moore and Gibbons accordingly so they could proceed with their claim.

Were they cheated? Was there really a strong expectation that the book would go out of print and they would then be entitled to ownership? If that was the case, it might have made sense to eliminate that clause, though I have the benefit of hindsight, I know.

I don't think there's any question, by the way, that Watchmen's &quot;heroes&quot; were based on the Charlton characters that DC owned. The reason their names were changed is probably well known to most of those discerning fans you cite.

Wish it were otherwise but that's where it's at. If not, maybe they can find a lawyer who can make a case for them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Peter Krause:</p>
<p>If it were up to me, I would certainly bestow all rights to Watchmen on Alan and Dave.</p>
<p>But it&#8217;s not up to me; in the real world, DC has a valid claim to those rights.</p>
<p>Is it morally correct? Again, not to me. But it seems to be legally valid. If it isn&#8217;t, I&#8217;d hope an attorney would advise Moore and Gibbons accordingly so they could proceed with their claim.</p>
<p>Were they cheated? Was there really a strong expectation that the book would go out of print and they would then be entitled to ownership? If that was the case, it might have made sense to eliminate that clause, though I have the benefit of hindsight, I know.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t think there&#8217;s any question, by the way, that Watchmen&#8217;s &#8220;heroes&#8221; were based on the Charlton characters that DC owned. The reason their names were changed is probably well known to most of those discerning fans you cite.</p>
<p>Wish it were otherwise but that&#8217;s where it&#8217;s at. If not, maybe they can find a lawyer who can make a case for them.
</p>
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		<title>by: Shawn Hill</title>
		<link>http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/12/09/i-guess-this-was-a-long-time-ago/#comment-2704601</link>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Dec 2008 16:25:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/12/09/i-guess-this-was-a-long-time-ago/#comment-2704601</guid>
					<description>It's ironic to be prevented from profiting from your own extreme success. I also think of the service Watchmen continues to provide, as it's probably keeping many comic stores in the black all by itself to this day. I can't wait for the movie; I don't think it's a sacred text that can't be altered for film, so I agree more with the unjaded Moore of back in the day than the current extremely disgruntled (perhaps rightfully so) one. DC should play nicer, but we've all seen how they don't, time and time again.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It&#8217;s ironic to be prevented from profiting from your own extreme success. I also think of the service Watchmen continues to provide, as it&#8217;s probably keeping many comic stores in the black all by itself to this day. I can&#8217;t wait for the movie; I don&#8217;t think it&#8217;s a sacred text that can&#8217;t be altered for film, so I agree more with the unjaded Moore of back in the day than the current extremely disgruntled (perhaps rightfully so) one. DC should play nicer, but we&#8217;ve all seen how they don&#8217;t, time and time again.
</p>
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		<title>by: Peter Krause</title>
		<link>http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/12/09/i-guess-this-was-a-long-time-ago/#comment-2704363</link>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Dec 2008 14:24:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/12/09/i-guess-this-was-a-long-time-ago/#comment-2704363</guid>
					<description>Hmmm....

Richard Pachter:

While Rorschach may have been &quot;inspired&quot; (&quot;derived&quot; is your term) by the Question,  I think any discerning comics fan would see Rorschach is his own character.  A character created by Gibbons and Moore.

I would extend that argument to the rest of the Watchmen.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hmmm&#8230;.</p>
<p>Richard Pachter:</p>
<p>While Rorschach may have been &#8220;inspired&#8221; (&#8221;derived&#8221; is your term) by the Question,  I think any discerning comics fan would see Rorschach is his own character.  A character created by Gibbons and Moore.</p>
<p>I would extend that argument to the rest of the Watchmen.
</p>
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		<title>by: Rich Johnston</title>
		<link>http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/12/09/i-guess-this-was-a-long-time-ago/#comment-2703855</link>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Dec 2008 10:16:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/12/09/i-guess-this-was-a-long-time-ago/#comment-2703855</guid>
					<description>It wasn't &quot;back door&quot;. But none of the people who signed that contract, Moore, Gibbons or DC Comics themselves believed that Watchmen would stay in print. Because comics, even trade paperbacks, didn't.

Circumstances changed. Moore tried to renegotiate with DC, DC refused, Moore left.

Later DC Comics decided that they would renegotiate with Gaiman over Sandman to prevent a similar situation, but declined to revisit previous decisions.

It's a similar situation to the Writers Strike in the USA of late. Contracts signed in previous times become dated when they don't take into account a changing marketplace - in that case, DVDs and the internet. In Watchmen's case, trade paperbacks that stay in print.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It wasn&#8217;t &#8220;back door&#8221;. But none of the people who signed that contract, Moore, Gibbons or DC Comics themselves believed that Watchmen would stay in print. Because comics, even trade paperbacks, didn&#8217;t.</p>
<p>Circumstances changed. Moore tried to renegotiate with DC, DC refused, Moore left.</p>
<p>Later DC Comics decided that they would renegotiate with Gaiman over Sandman to prevent a similar situation, but declined to revisit previous decisions.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s a similar situation to the Writers Strike in the USA of late. Contracts signed in previous times become dated when they don&#8217;t take into account a changing marketplace - in that case, DVDs and the internet. In Watchmen&#8217;s case, trade paperbacks that stay in print.
</p>
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		<title>by: Richard Pachter</title>
		<link>http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/12/09/i-guess-this-was-a-long-time-ago/#comment-2702264</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Dec 2008 20:29:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/12/09/i-guess-this-was-a-long-time-ago/#comment-2702264</guid>
					<description>Let's see: the characters are derived from those owned by DC and the demand for the book has been sufficient to keep it in print.

Maybe someone else can explain how this is &quot;back door&quot; as I don't see any subterfuge here.

I'm certainly no fan of corporatism or work-for-hire, but jeez, the &quot;DC ripped off Watchmen from Alan Moore&quot; trope seems patently specious.

&quot;DC would go through a back door play on his contract and keep the book in print so long they’d get all the money.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Let&#8217;s see: the characters are derived from those owned by DC and the demand for the book has been sufficient to keep it in print.</p>
<p>Maybe someone else can explain how this is &#8220;back door&#8221; as I don&#8217;t see any subterfuge here.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m certainly no fan of corporatism or work-for-hire, but jeez, the &#8220;DC ripped off Watchmen from Alan Moore&#8221; trope seems patently specious.</p>
<p>&#8220;DC would go through a back door play on his contract and keep the book in print so long they’d get all the money.&#8221;
</p>
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		<title>by: mark coale</title>
		<link>http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/12/09/i-guess-this-was-a-long-time-ago/#comment-2702241</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Dec 2008 19:57:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/12/09/i-guess-this-was-a-long-time-ago/#comment-2702241</guid>
					<description>I was most amused by the comments about joel silver then vs now.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was most amused by the comments about joel silver then vs now.
</p>
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		<title>by: James Patrick</title>
		<link>http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/12/09/i-guess-this-was-a-long-time-ago/#comment-2702219</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Dec 2008 19:15:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/12/09/i-guess-this-was-a-long-time-ago/#comment-2702219</guid>
					<description>I wasn't knocking Moore, just simply observing how his attitude has changed through the years and after a series of events.  Anyway you look at it, his attitude changed.  A different time. All I'm saying.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I wasn&#8217;t knocking Moore, just simply observing how his attitude has changed through the years and after a series of events.  Anyway you look at it, his attitude changed.  A different time. All I&#8217;m saying.
</p>
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		<title>by: Kenny</title>
		<link>http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/12/09/i-guess-this-was-a-long-time-ago/#comment-2702214</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Dec 2008 18:57:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/12/09/i-guess-this-was-a-long-time-ago/#comment-2702214</guid>
					<description>I don't see how this shows a change in attitude from Moore. Back then, I think Moore felt he owned the Watchmen and would be getting that big option money. I don't think he figured back then that DC would go through a back door play on his contract and keep the book in print so long they'd get all the money. Also, Moore thought he was going to be writing the script.... If anything, it shows what a monumentally shitty thing DC did by screwing him out of the rights.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t see how this shows a change in attitude from Moore. Back then, I think Moore felt he owned the Watchmen and would be getting that big option money. I don&#8217;t think he figured back then that DC would go through a back door play on his contract and keep the book in print so long they&#8217;d get all the money. Also, Moore thought he was going to be writing the script&#8230;. If anything, it shows what a monumentally shitty thing DC did by screwing him out of the rights.
</p>
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		<title>by: chris7crows</title>
		<link>http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/12/09/i-guess-this-was-a-long-time-ago/#comment-2702204</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Dec 2008 18:49:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/12/09/i-guess-this-was-a-long-time-ago/#comment-2702204</guid>
					<description>&quot;They’re not going to give Rorschach a friendly waggy-tailed dog.&quot;

As it turns out, they're only changing the entire conclusion.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;They’re not going to give Rorschach a friendly waggy-tailed dog.&#8221;</p>
<p>As it turns out, they&#8217;re only changing the entire conclusion.
</p>
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		<title>by: James Patrick</title>
		<link>http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/12/09/i-guess-this-was-a-long-time-ago/#comment-2702189</link>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Dec 2008 18:27:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://pwbeat.publishersweekly.com/blog/2008/12/09/i-guess-this-was-a-long-time-ago/#comment-2702189</guid>
					<description>As for Moore's attitutude. 

The times they are a changin'.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As for Moore&#8217;s attitutude. </p>
<p>The times they are a changin&#8217;.
</p>
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